Old Farts Forum

[Egyptian]

Andy, how about a private forum for us "seasoned techs" over 50 or so?

I am sure we have a lot of things that we might discuss that the younger crowd would not be interested in.

Egyptian

[andy]

Age 50 is an old fart???!

Damn, I'm getting close! cryaby:

[reprob8]

Egyptian over 50? Ha! You're better off cutting off one of his legs and counting the rings. Heck, the guy was a waiter at the last supper.biggrin:

[nastyb]

If you live, you age, but....no says you have to act your age!:smile1:

[Mas_o_menos]

Now calm down kiddies. Be nice to your seniors. We were young once. We just can't remember it anymore....................

[cooch56]

I'll take a 12AT7 or a 6AU6 over a SN4001 or SN74LS121 anyday. How's that for showing your age.

[Egyptian]

Did you work on ARC-27s? Both of those tubes were used in the RT unit.

Egyptian

[Simtech655]

Did you say over "50" or over "60" forum ?huh4:

[Egyptian]

Well, I am 60, but I feel like 100

If you recognize that radio, you are pretty old to

[nastyb]

I recognized those numbers as being tube part numbers. Maybe I'm not as forgetful as I thought. Hey, what is considered "old" when you are 50 and over??huh4:

[nastyb]

On second thought, maybe I am forgetful.burnout:

[The Pirate]

old is trying to explain to your neices and nephews that Paul Mcartney really was in a musical group called the "Beattles". or that the rolling stones have been on that same tour since 1962!!!

[Simtech655]

There was a time when I thought 50 was old, But not any more. However, since I just turned 50 I have learned that I have things that now hurt that I did not know I had.

[Mas_o_menos]

"You know you are old when"..................

People younger than you start having "old" people problems.

Next.............

[SimGeek]

I'll take a 12AT7 or a 6AU6 over a SN4001 or SN74LS121 anyday. How's that for showing your age.

6L6's rule the output world, OZ2's regulate, 80's and 5U4's rectify.

Well "seasoned techs" know how to open up the vibrator for their car radio, so they can clean and adjust the points, no use spending good money on a replacement if you can get a few more weeks of service out of the old one.

Of course the "seasoned tech" can still name the tube lineup in an "All American Five" radio. Ill give you a start 35W4, name the other four tubes. headscrat

On the sim side, remember the stacks of pots in the analog servos? How about the shape of the various forms the restive elements were wound around to give non-linier functions. Or trying to get the P-Factor (prop torque) pot lined up just right in an engine servo stack.

[cooch56]

We used those tubes on the MB-26s summing amps. The finger tip burns are finally gone, now can feel things again. Used too crank up the filiment voltage on the ol' tube tester too just watch tubes burn out, what excitment. Won't be in the over 50 club till next year, just preping myself for it.

[Simtech655]

I don't remember the numbers, but all american 5 did not have the RF amplifier as the all american 6. I sealed up the vibrator after cutting it open and using emery cloth on the points and they worked for a long time.

[simxxi]

Gee!! I'm not even that old yet and I use work on 618T's, both 102's and 105's and APN-59's.

[Egyptian]

Not old enough, I worked on ARC 3s and APS 42s. How about a BC 348 or a T412?

Egyptian

[SimGeek]

Not old enough, I worked on ARC 3s and APS 42s. How about a BC 348 or a T412?

EgyptianNever worked on them as a job, but I had several surplus ARC-5's a BC-610 and several BC-611's I bought through the MARS program when I was in high school.

Got several of them on the air, and used others as a source of parts to build other projects out of the ARRL handbook. In those days you could still get tons of surplus equipment very very cheep.

[kean]

Dual DC amps with autocheckers! Gray scale landmass with flying spot scanners!!

[Textech]

I remember falling asleep while the auto checkers were doing their thing when I was a young hung over airman. When it got quiet, I would wake up, and tweek, or smack it to get it to go again.

[Bill Bisbing]

-10's; packing tiny motor bearings, setting brush tensions dialing in one of two radio stations and acting as a crew member and ATC. Just a few of the wonderful things we did!!!!

[Doctor Clutch]

F-4?s had that Grey scale landmass and flying spot scanner. Always made me nervous working around the optics with the cover off that assembly, especially powered up in the dark. The first time I did a bore sight alignment on the FSS I got a nice black eye out of the deal. After tweaking it for a while I got pretty comfortable about exactly where the yolk adjustments were and didn?t want to take my eye off of the bore sight tool. When my hand started to wander towards the High Voltage standoff the SSgt that was instructing me smacked my hand out of the way so I wouldn?t get zapped. When he did that my eye hit the bore sight eyepiece and I got my little shiner. Small price to pay for a well-learned lesson. If your reading this Steve Pollard, Thanks Again. wink:

[Egyptian]

Remeber loading the 703 from paper tape? Or GP4s from the old IBM tape drives? Our age is showing.

Egyptian

[bluesman]

Remember rewinding those paper tapes, getting paper cuts or splicing the tape because it got hung up and broke?

Remember AND boards, OR boards, etc...

Remember card readers (pukka pukka pukka pukka pukka pshhhhhh)

Oh what fun.

[martinshear]

I am looking for spares for a GAT 1 simulator I want to revive. Any ideas where I can get some.

[The Pirate]

"back in the day" we had an ibm card reader that loaded a huge data base to run air control problems for the ac's and os's. it would run a heck of a lot faster that the old spring pin readers before it, but there was a huge optical prizm wheel that picked the cards, the light shined through the holes and the reader picked it up. it would run a stack of ibm cards about 3 ft high in about a minute and a half. problem prizm has very hot bright light, prizm magnify's it...paper gets hot, sticky, ibm forgot to put a paper jam stop in the machine, we would get a nice raging fire about 3 times a week, as the operators would load the cards and walk away as it loaded. good damage control drills, and it took about a week to slice and pull out all the burnt cards with dental picks and tweezers.
Old fart, heh, "youth challenged ".

[Egyptian]

I am looking for spares for a GAT 1 simulator I want to revive. Any ideas where I can get some.


Yoiu can probably contact FRASCA on their web site. Look on Frasca.com. They used to work a lot on those old trainers.

Egyptian

[The Farm]

Remeber loading the 703 from paper tape? Or GP4s from the old IBM tape drives? Our age is showing.

Egyptian
Did you ever try restoring a couple of bands on the drum from the KSR-35 paper tape reader(maybe ASR-35)?
I don't remember 703, may not have seen one, but I still remember duplicating punch cards so the finicie card reader would load with out jamming.

[Egyptian]

That was a Raytheon 703 digital computer used to run a singer tri color land mass system. Was amazing how fast that paper tape ran out on the floor.

Egyptian

[kean]

The original C5 and C141 sims had a high speed paper tape reader on the SEL 840A and 840MP computers. That would put a pile of paper tape on the floor in a hurry. We had to rewind the tape with a hand cranked device. What a relief it was when the INS was installed and we could load the computers with an eight inch floppy in a hard case using a TI 990 computer.

[DELU3487]

I'm probably doing my first post wrong but here goes.
For all you old Air Force mobile sim guys/gals out there, I may have something of interest for you. I finally finished moving the KC-135 support car from FL to my property in TN and while I was fishing around through the various cabinets I ran across numerous schematics for the sim circuitry. If anyone is interested in having them I would be happy to send them to you. They my give you a ride down memory lane. First dibs will of course go to folks who actually worked on the KC-135 or B-52 mobile sims. There are about 15 rolls of drawings and they came out of the railcar DOEX-60. The doors on the side of the railcar are emblazoned with the name ?The Wandering Zulus? so if you worked from that particular car you get top choice. There is also a map of Malmstrom AFB in the pile of drawings. Please get the word out to all the old mobile operators you know. I would love to here from all of you about your experiences. I plan on tuning the railcar into a B&B so if you are ever in east TN stop by for a visit. If you want to contact me directly my work e-mail is John.deluca@<hidden>.
Thanks
John

[bluesman]

Kean,

How many paper cuts did you get winding up tapes?

How many times did a tape get snagged on your shoe and break when you were winding it up. DOH!

The neat thing about those beasts is that you didn't have to go through that all that often. You loaded that paper tape in and if you didn't have to shut it off, it probably ran for days.

What kind of computers were you loading?

I worked on a Goodyear E2A sim that had a UNIVAC 1230. What a beast.

[Gizmotech]

jimi1: Depends on which side of the big 50 you are. Andy will get there someday and I bet he changes his position on the definition of old.

[andy]

Ack! I can hear my biological clock ticking louder and louder! hide1:

I'm not that far away from 50 anymore!!!

[woodchopper]

I thought that was one of those really loud stereo systems from a teenager going by on the freeway.biggrin:

[kean]

Bluesman,

Pleanty of paper cuts. Did not break the tape too often because we used tape that had a mylar center. The computers were SEL 840A and 840MP, they were an OCTAL machine that used 2 each 2K core memory bircks. You had to load the boot strap by paddle switchs on the front panel. The were about the size of an upright piano (and kinda looked like one) and had card frames that swung out from the back. I believe that they were RTL logic.

The biggest pain in the butt working on these machines was be stuck on days or swings and having to run radio aids. It got to the point were you could read the scripts in your sleep. A.F. instructors were too good to do their own radio calls.

[kean]

Doctor Clutch,

I remember doing an bore sight alignment on a FSS at Shaw AFB on a RF-4C. I was by myself and the GP4 computer that was behind the landmass cab ended up with a nice dent in it from my head when I got onto the anode line.

[guest]

I'm not as good as I once was, But I'm as good once as I ever was.

[cooch56]

Doctor Clutch,

I remember doing an bore sight alignment on a FSS at Shaw AFB on a RF-4C. I was by myself and the GP4 computer that was behind the landmass cab ended up with a nice dent in it from my head when I got onto the anode line.

So that's what happen to ya. I was wondering :biggrin:

[kean]

Couch,

So what is your Problem!!!!!!

[cooch56]

Couch,

So what is your Problem!!!!!!

Didn't mean too rattle your cage Kean. I know the site at Sanford is rattling it enough for you.

[kean]

Couch,

No problem!! A bang on the head is what I take around here on a daily basis. Fighting the bean counters to buy a $2.00 part would send anyone to the funny farm. Oh by the way things are getting real interesting. You need to stop by. All I need to do now is get rid of this twich!!!!! I should of put a LOL on my last message.

[MAllen]

Couch doesn't have any problems, he's just like me "born this way" been working for years. Right Couch?

[cooch56]

Gee, either I need to change my name to COUCH or ya'll need too have eyes checked. lolhit:

[MAllen]

Damn these glasses, or maybe I just need new fingers, or just need to learn how to spell.. sad6:

[kean]

damm being blind. Thats the reason I where I am at now!!!!!! three fingers, no five, maybe six

[JarHead]

F-4?s had that Grey scale landmass and flying spot scanner. Always made me nervous working around the optics with the cover off that assembly, especially powered up in the dark. The first time I did a bore sight alignment on the FSS I got a nice black eye out of the deal. After tweaking it for a while I got pretty comfortable about exactly where the yolk adjustments were and didn?t want to take my eye off of the bore sight tool. When my hand started to wander towards the High Voltage standoff the SSgt that was instructing me smacked my hand out of the way so I wouldn?t get zapped. When he did that my eye hit the bore sight eyepiece and I got my little shiner. Small price to pay for a well-learned lesson. If your reading this Steve Pollard, Thanks Again. wink:

The Marines had a similar device, '2F15C' PTT for the RF4.
My experience was similar, but I had a WM L/Cpl (Ex Go-Go Dancer) to cussion the blow to the back of my head. My hand slipped off the insulation. I WAS the S/Sgt.

[Rick Cole]

You can't call yourself an F4 sim tech till you've been touched by the landmass.

[sandy61]

If your reading this Steve Pollard, Thanks Again. wink:
I last saw Steve in Boise Idaho back around 1995. He was biding his time waiting for retirement from the AF by working as the AF liaison to the guard unit there which was still flying the F-4G Weasel. I think he was planning on retiring up there. Bob Lathrop was also there but he was a civvy working on the G. Ahhh...I miss the F-4.

[markeby]

Only as long as the rubber band and paper clip was in place.

The original C5 and C141 sims had a high speed paper tape reader on the SEL 840A and 840MP computers. That would put a pile of paper tape on the floor in a hurry. We had to rewind the tape with a hand cranked device. What a relief it was when the INS was installed and we could load the computers with an eight inch floppy in a hard case using a TI 990 computer.

[kean]

Do not remember the rubber band and paper clip!

[Jeff]

I'll take a 12AT7 or a 6AU6 over a SN4001 or SN74LS121 anyday. How's that for showing your age.

How about 6N7 or 6L6GT? Or 2N87? Or 1N91? I think I have some of these in my electronics junk box. About 20 years ago I cleaned up my box and threw out all the old 4 pin triodes and "Loctal" socket tubes.

First sim worked was MB-40, F-101B Voodoo, (Oxnard AFB, CA) 1963
Oldest sim worked was S-7 Curtiss-Wright C-124A (Hickam AFB, HA) 1966.